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    I need some help with my extension wiring

    This is a discussion on I need some help with my extension wiring within the Speed tests and how to get better results forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; Hi everybody, I connected the Netgear wireless router/modem directly to my BT socket using only one microfilter to both my ...

    1. #1
      jonathanen's Avatar
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      I need some help with my extension wiring

      Hi everybody, I connected the Netgear wireless router/modem directly to my BT socket using only one microfilter to both my modem & my BT cordless phone, and here is my statistics as follows:

      /usr/sbin/adslctl: ADSL driver and PHY status
      Status: Showtime Channel: FAST, Upstream rate = 764 Kbps, Downstream rate = 15323 Kbps
      Link Power State: L0
      Mode: ADSL2+
      Channel: Fast
      Trellis: ON
      Line Status: No Defect
      Training Status: Showtime
      Down Up
      SNR (dB): 9.0 12.5
      Attn(dB): 31.0 18.8
      Pwr(dBm): 1.3 12.4
      Max(Kbps): 16284 864
      Rate (Kbps): 15323 764
      G.dmt framing
      K: 239(0) 24
      R: 16 16
      S: 1 8
      D: 64 8
      ADSL2 framing
      MSGc: 59 68
      B: 238 23
      M: 1 8
      T: 2 1
      R: 16 16
      S: 0.4980 7.7037
      L: 4096 216
      D: 64 8
      Counters
      SF: 33600 33598
      SFErr: 29 1
      RS: 4368116 285583
      RSCorr: 4250 1
      RSUnCorr: 809 0

      HEC: 29 0
      OCD: 0 0
      LCD: 0 0
      Total Cells: 19678653 976499
      Data Cells: 87826 9918
      Drop Cells: 0
      Bit Errors: 0 0

      ES: 3 1
      SES: 2 0
      UAS: 14 692
      Total time = 9 min 24 sec
      SF = 33600
      CRC = 29
      LOS = 1
      LOF = 0
      ES = 3
      Latest 1 day time = 9 min 24 sec
      SF = 33600
      CRC = 29
      LOS = 1
      LOF = 0
      ES = 3
      Latest 15 minutes time = 9 min 24 sec
      SF = 33600
      CRC = 29
      LOS = 1
      LOF = 0
      ES = 3
      Previous 15 minutes time = 0 sec
      SF = 0
      CRC = 0
      LOS = 0
      LOF = 0
      ES = 0
      Previous 1 day time = 0 sec
      SF = 0
      CRC = 0
      LOS = 0
      LOF = 0
      ES = 0

      But, here comes the problem, is there any way of connecting 2 x Binatone speakerphone 510sms corded phones, 2 x BT Freelance XA500 cordless phones, 1 x Sky+ digibox (Pace TDS470N) & 1 x standard Sky digibox (Pace DS440NB) and Sky Netgear DG834GT modem/router to one BT phone socket with 3 x microfilters, 1 x double phone adaptor, 1 x triple phone adaptor, 3 x 15m extension cable reels & 1 x 10m extension cable reel for my standard Sky box in the living room. And still able to use the phone / sky+ or standard sky boxes online interactive service at the same time with the Internet on all the time using the full 15323 kbps without any problems.

      I have drawed a diagram to show you what I mean.

      I think one of the microfilters is faulty. Is there any way of buying more of these same microfilters that supplied with Sky Broadband package or is it better to buy the best microfilters avaiable in the market.

      I'm 960 metres away (approx 965 metres) from Maida Vale exchange (as the crow flies), by the way, does it means that I'm 2.2 kilometers away from Maida Vale exchange (31 db / 13.8 = 2.2463768) - according to Sky router stats (speed, noise, attenuation) explained forum.

      I really appreciate it if you help me.
      Last edited by jonathanen; 07-11-07 at 01:18 AM.


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    3. #2
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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      When people say they have drawn a diagram, it rarely means they get pencil and paper out these days... it made me smile, well done!

      That is a fairly complicated little diagram though, and I'm not entirely sure I understand it all, but I may be able to help with a couple of things.

      Firstly a BT landline can only have a limited number of devices connected that need to 'ring'. This is called Ringer Equivalence Number or REN. Phones will usually tell you on the base, what REN value they have. BT landlines will work up to four REN. So you'll need to check if all those phones will take you over the magic number.

      Secondly, the extension cables you mention look like the cheaper flat cable type. These generally don't work very well along side broadband, or if the broadband signal is carried along it.

      I suspect your connection sync would drop dramatically if you implement all that wiring.

      As for the microfilter, like many things, you get what you pay for. ADSLnation filters are generally considered the best.

    4. #3
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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      Thanks for your reply! As for the diagram, its the only way I can show what I mean, because its quite hard for me to describe it. And to be honest, its very complicated. Because the living room is right next to hallway which is where the main BT master socket is, and that one is an old fashion type BT socket without engineers test socket inside the master socket and here are the pictures that I have taken with my Premier digital camera as follows:

      Photo 1 and Photo 2

      And my bedroom upstairs with Sky+ box, Corded house phone, Netgear modem. Its all connected to one BT Master socket downstairs hallway.

      Ah, ha! I see, these Masterplug standard 15m extension cable reels from Agros cat no: 552/0255 (page 1034 in Autumn/Winter 2007 Argos Catalogue) which is 8.99 each are not very good for Sky Broadband package. Which one shall I get? I need only one connecting from the hallway to my bedroom upstairs for the Netgear modem

      I have checked all four phones, or shall I say 3 phones because BT Freelance XA500 Twin pack Cordless phone has one 1 phone base with answermachine connected the phone line and the other headset doesn't connect to the phone line.

      2 x Binatone speakerphone 510SMS - REN: 1 (My favourite phone)
      1 x BT Freelance XA500 Twin - REN: 1.0

      But I'm not sure about REN for both Sky digibox (Pace DS440NB) & Sky+ digibox (Pace TDS470N).

      I think that I may need more microfilters for both Sky & Sky+ boxes. As for ADSLnation filters, do you mean Belkin ADSL In-Line Filter featured in page 1075 from Autumn/Winter 2007 Argos Catalogue?
      Last edited by jonathanen; 07-11-07 at 07:56 PM.

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      An idea has just come inside my head!! So, I draw a quick rough plan on paper before I forget and I scanned it so that I can show you what I mean. Does this setup works?

      I mean, do I still get the full 15323 Kbps with this setup, so that I can make phone calls at the same while the internet is on all the time?

    6. #5
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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      Right ok, I'll try and deal with everything... First of all, your sky boxes don't have a REN number as they don't ring, so it sounds like the REN isn't a problem.

      Secondly, as for the second diagram you would not need a second adsl filter after the living room extension, as its already filtered by the first. So you would only need two filters.

      When I said ADSLnation, I meant ADSLnation.co.uk. They make very good filters, which generally seem to get better results.

      The extension to the bedroom with the router on may well work, however I expect you would loose some sync and therefore speed. If it simply isn't possible to have the router next to the master socket, then a properly installed twisted pair (round cable) extension would suit you better. However that might be something you want to look at improving in the future.

      Thanks for the pics too... you have remembered about that new fangled chip and pin haven't you?

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      Its a pleasure! I'm more of planning first kind of a guy. Always thinking / researching, planning on paper first before I start experimenting the real thing. Actually, I should be thanking you for helping me.

      Wow! You're right, it worked with only 2 Microfilters, having the full 15353, but when I start testing to use the phone when the Internet is on at the same, I noticed the Noise Margin jumped from 8.6db to 3.2db and router disconnects suddenly.

      Then I realised that you're right again, all I need to buy a properly twisted pair (round cable) extension, hoping that I can get 15m long to connect from BT socket to my bedroom. After all that, hoping that my parents and I can make lots of phone calls / using Interactive services from Sky boxes at the same time while the Internet is on all the time.

      Thanks very much, you're a star! You're the best!! I'll let you know how I go with the round twisted cable extension.
      Last edited by jonathanen; 07-11-07 at 11:26 PM.

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      Ok, as I mentioned in my first post all that extension work will cause interference. Which will be causing that noise margin drop.

      You could do with disconnecting the 'ring' wire which is orange usually with a white fleck. The wire is not needed by most phones (and not needed by any when it's plugged in via a microfilter). However if you are going to be using pre-made extensions with ends crimped on, that's a bit difficult.

      Hope you get it all sorted soon. Glad to have helped.

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      Hi again, I just to let you know that I take your advice and purchased ADSL HIGH SPEED BROADBAND EXTENSION CABLE 20m RJ11 from ebay.

      While I'm waiting for the extension cable to come by post, I draw another set of diagrams, this time with twisted pair round extension cable in place as follows:

      Final ADSL Plan A
      Final ADSL Plan B

      After all that time researching on the Internet, I think Final ADSL Plan A is much better and most efficient way - Single filter as showed in Broadband Connection - usage and troubleshooting web site.

      Thanks for all your help, I couldn't have done it without your help. I owe you big time.

      By the way, Orange wire and the other wires are already disconnected, as shown in Photo 1, only 2 & 5 are connected with blue / white wires, lucky for me, no need for me to do it, its already done when my parents bought this house before I was born (1980).
      Last edited by jonathanen; 15-06-09 at 09:11 AM.

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      I agree, plan A is best.

      Glad to have been a help. Donations excepted, there is a collection jar next to the exit. Cheques should be made payable to 'terrorvis solutions ltd.'

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      Re: I need some help with my extension wiring

      personally (and i just say this from my own experience) i'd have the router in the master via a filter and run ethernet cable to the PC - what you then plug into the phone side of the filter won't matter as they'd have no affect on the BB signal...

      BB, especially the speed you're receiving, will always be affected the more cable you add to the equation so it's best to minimise it and just keep the router at the master - preferably via an XTE-2005 filtered faceplate (assuming you have a master socket with a test socket). This way the signal is as strong as it can be and (hopefully) keep a stable and fast connection!!
      -------------------------------------------



      Useful Sticky: - How To Obtain Your Router Stats, BT Speed Test, Check For Test Socket

     

     
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