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    What does the 50 charge cover?

    This is a discussion on What does the 50 charge cover? within the Sky Broadband (Fibre) Help forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; I know it is early days as yet and people may not have a definitive answer to this. I am ...

    1. #1
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      What does the 50 charge cover?

      I know it is early days as yet and people may not have a definitive answer to this.

      I am on Sky Broadband U/L & have confirmed on BT Infinity site that I could get 40Mb/10Mb.

      I currently have a pre-NTE5 socket (ie no test socket). Is it likely that the installation charge will include the change to a NTE5-like socket for fibre or will I be charged more (on the presumption that a NTE5 socket is installed)?

      I assume also that if I want the socket moving (from one side of a window to the other - 2-3 yards) I will have to pay for that myself, unless I can blag the engineer into doing it free


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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      The installation charge will include a visit from a BTO engineer, who will provide new wiring if necessary and a suitable line socket. This will more likely be the newer VDSL box which is suitable for fibre and ADSL. Where required the engineer will also by-pass the existing XNTE should one be fitted.

      TomD


      Please note the views and recommendations in my posts are my own and in no way reflect the views of SkyUser.


      Useful Utilites

      https://www.nirsoft.net/utils/wifi_information_view.html/ TCPOptimiser /Test Socket

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      I had my very old BT filtered faceplate removed and a new Fibre one installed as part of my infinity install.

      If also needed they will fit a data extention kit, of up to 30m cabling if your PC is nowhere near your master socket.

      I was lucky and had my master socket right by my PC so we didn't have to get into that.

      The engineer will also bring the modem and Sky will send you the router, the modem is OpenReach property so no selling on eBay.

      He will also then go off to the cabinet and hook up your line to the cabinet and then come back and make sure it is all working.

      For me it was 90mins but he couldn't get into the cab as he didn't have a key and he had to nip back to the exchange to get one.

      As to getting the master moved a nice cup of tea with some fancy biscuits and asking very nicely may go a long way.
      I'm a PC, and Windows 7 Backup saved my sanity when BitDefender imploded !!!

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      I would be in exactly the same situation (if FTTC ever comes here; which I very much doubt as we only got LLU last year!!!) as my master phone socket is also a pre-NTE5 socket.

      Silly question but how are you connected to the cab? Is it an over-head line or do they have to dig up your garden & street etc? My phone line comes to my house via a telegraph pole if that makes any difference.

    8. #5
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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      Quote Originally Posted by James_Mitchell View Post
      I would be in exactly the same situation (if FTTC ever comes here; which I very much doubt as we only got LLU last year!!!) as my master phone socket is also a pre-NTE5 socket.
      LLU systems are installed by the ISPs. FTTC is installed by BTO. The funding comes from different sources, so timing of one will not dictate the other. All telephone exchanges will be upgraded by 2020. This is a stated target.

      As for the socket, for anyone who does not have an NTE5 socket, the BTO Installation Engineer will install one when the Fibre connection is installed.

      Quote Originally Posted by James_Mitchell View Post
      Silly question but how are you connected to the cab? Is it an over-head line or do they have to dig up your garden & street etc? My phone line comes to my house via a telegraph pole if that makes any difference.
      FTTC uses the very same copper cables that you currently have between your home and the green street cabinet. It would not matter how your current cables are connected to the cabinet, so long as you have a good connection and are not too far from the cabinet.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      Quote Originally Posted by Undecided Adrian View Post
      If also needed they will fit a data extention kit, of up to 30m cabling if your PC is nowhere near your master socket.
      I was thinking that I'd need my master socket moving .. but the data extension kit might work just as well, if I could think of a decent way of routing the cable - is this, in effect, an extension socket that will be classed as the master (for when I get the inevitable question "are you plugged into the master socket")?

      I'm assuming this kit would cost extra?

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      From chatting with Dave and run-IT-direct yesterday, the extension kit is just a 300m roll of Cat 5e Ethernet cable, some crimp plugs and something to fix the cable out of the way from feet.

      He couldn't confirm if there is an extension available for the BTO Modem to connect to the master socket or what the process would be if there isn't a power source near to the socket. If someone can confirm what this is, it would very much be appreciated.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      From what you describe then (and I apologise for sounding thick .. it's just I'm not used to having to think of location two seperate boxes for my incoming broadband!) the data cable is simply a long network cable from the modem (which is connected to the master BT socket, and plugged into a nearby power socket) to the router (which is plugged into another power socket and, in our case, our computers).

      I was assuming the data extension kit would be the extension of the connection from the master BT socket to the modem.

      Other than moving my master socket (which seems to cost anywhere from free to 130 ish, depending on how good your sweet-talking is), is there any type of extension available from the master socket to the modem?

      Is this one of those things where they say its not recommended, but it would actually work? Or would it simply not work for some reason?

      (I realise that some of this may have been asked before... in fact, I seem to be nicking half of Scubbie's question .. but we may have more information now than then )

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      Quote Originally Posted by Stumpy View Post
      From what you describe then (and I apologise for sounding thick .. it's just I'm not used to having to think of location two seperate boxes for my incoming broadband!) the data cable is simply a long network cable from the modem (which is connected to the master BT socket, and plugged into a nearby power socket) to the router (which is plugged into another power socket and, in our case, our computers).

      I was assuming the data extension kit would be the extension of the connection from the master BT socket to the modem.
      That is correct about the cable between the Modem and the Router and the Modem and Router power requirements.

      When i first heard the term I thought that this might be the case too with the Modem to Master socket being able to be extended.

      Quote Originally Posted by Stumpy View Post
      Other than moving my master socket (which seems to cost anywhere from free to 130 ish, depending on how good your sweet-talking is), is there any type of extension available from the master socket to the modem?

      Is this one of those things where they say its not recommended, but it would actually work? Or would it simply not work for some reason?

      (I realise that some of this may have been asked before... in fact, I seem to be nicking half of Scubbie's question .. but we may have more information now than then )
      I'll forgive you

      At this stage I suspect that I'll need to delve into some other forums to find any useful threads to confirm/deny this (unless someone out there wishes to volunteer please?)

      I suspect that there may be an issue though. With ADSL we tend to advise against using extension leads as we can often show the drop in speed, compared with using the short grey ADSL lead and the Master Socket. Since this is more of an issue with ADSL2+, compared to ADSL1, I can see that it would be worse with FTTC since the signal spectrum is wider and subject to more interference.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

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      Re: What does the 50 charge cover?

      this has been a topic of much confusion indeed, i guess mainly due to the wording sometimes used and confusing references between the modem and router, but as this is something that will effect me also i have been scouring thru various documents from places like the Openreach and BTW sites, which tend to refer to the modem as the Active NTE and dont keep confusing this with router references, i have come to the conclusion that the data extention kit is in fact for when you need the modem away from the master socket.

      On the BTWholesale site there are documents to explain the system in detail for CP's that are visible to see, 1 document is called the WBC FTTC Handbook
      https://www.btwholesale.com/shared/d...2011%20(3).pdf
      under section 6 - Customer Premises Equipment (CPE) is the following information:

      As part of the installation Openreach will install a Service Specific Front Plate and a VDSL2 modem (Active NTE)

      6.1 Service Specific Front Plate (SSFP)
      During the installation of the WBC FTTC service the Openreach engineer will fit a service specific front plate to the existing NTE5. Where no NTE5 exists, Openreach will install an NTE5 within 3 metres of the entrance to the End User premises.
      Where an external NTE exists, Openreach will install an NTE5 with service specific front plate internally immediately adjacent to the external NTE.
      A service specific front plate splits the delivery of telephony and DSL signals at the NTE5, delivering each service to a separate port on the socket. This terminates the DSL signal at this point, meaning the signal is not received on any telephone extension sockets that may exist.

      6.2 Active NTE
      A VDSL2 modem will be supplied and connected to the data port of the service specific front plate. This is an active NTE which allows BT to monitor and test the service provided. The active NTE must be within reach of a power supply, and must remain connected to the power and data port of the service specific front plate at all times.

      ADSL filters are not required in the End User‟s premises as the WBC FTTC service is provided to the NTE5 (and data extension kit if provided), and not through to the telephony extensions. If the filters are not removed there should be no impact on either the telephony or the WBC FTTC Service.

      The Openreach physical network demarcation point within the End User‟s premises is the NTE5 although Openreach will also install and maintain the active NTE. Any (optional) Openreach installed data extension wiring becomes the property of the End User but has a warranty period of 1 year.

      6.3 Data Extension Kit (Home Wiring Solution)
      If the active NTE is to be sited more than approximately 1.5 metres from the NTE5, a data extension kit will be required to deliver the Ethernet service to the modem. The data extension kit provides a maximum additional 30 Metres distance from the NTE5 and can be routed internally or externally to an additional data extension point where the active NTE can then be connected.
      The data extension kit is a chargeable addition; CP‟s are advised to determine whether this kit is required for their End Users in advance of an order being placed.
      CPs are able to decide on a per End User Access order basis if they want to:
      1. always have a Data Extension Kit installed or
      2. pre-authorise the End-User to request the installation of a Data Extension Kit if needed or
      3. not allow the End User an option to have a Data Extension Kit fitted.
      Data Extension Kit orders can only be placed with the provision order (new provide, simultaneous provide and migration). Any modification to the original order for dates etc will also apply to the accompanying Data Extension Kit order. The Data Extension Kit becomes the property of the End-User and carries a 12 month warranty from the date it was fitted by the engineer.
      Please note that the Home Wiring Solution should be ordered as the Data Extension Kit from BT Wholesale. BT Wholesale systems will convert Data Extension Kit items in any orders for the Home Wiring Solution, submitted to our supplier.

      hope this helps.

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