Your forum username:
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up


    Welcome to Sky User - The Unofficial Support Forum for everything Sky! - Proudly helping over 65k members.


    Advertisement

    Results 1 to 7 of 7
    Like Tree2Likes
    • 1 Post By Scubbie
    • 1 Post By jrfer

    To spy or not to spy, that is the question

    This is a discussion on To spy or not to spy, that is the question within the General chat forums, part of the Community channel category; With all the revelations from Edward Snowden about the NSA and GCHQ, do you think that it is right that ...

    1. #1
      Scubbie's Avatar
      Scubbie is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: 02392
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited
      Router: Sky Q Hub ER110
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Mar 2010
      Location
      Near Portsmouth
      Posts
      28,200
      Thanks
      842
      Thanked 2,223 Times in 2,092 Posts

      To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      With all the revelations from Edward Snowden about the NSA and GCHQ, do you think that it is right that they should have unimpeded access to every device connected to the Internet around the world?

      It seems to me that the game of spying is being practised by more than just the USA and Briton.

      We have been more than aware of Cyber Warfare for some time now, with various groups launching DDoS attacks on different institutions and a few countries too.

      Viruses were once written to mess up a computer, destroy data and lose the owner their documents. Now we hear of attacks which lock the owner out of their computer until a ransom is paid, groups of computers being used together to attack a specific site and hackers gaining access to a host of personal information.

      The reason provided by the various governments to allow them to spy on every device connected to the Internet, telephone and mobile phones, is that they are watching to prevent an act of terrorism.

      I find that this conflicts with our own laws which stipulate that we are innocent unless proven guilty.

      Do you believe that the governments should be allowed to capture all our private thoughts in order to ensure that our society is safe?

      The next question is: Safe from whom?

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms


    2. Advertisement
    3. #2
      Tezcatlipoca's Avatar
      Tezcatlipoca is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: Cambridge (EACAM)
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro
      Router: Sky Hub SR101
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Feb 2007
      Location
      Cambridge
      Posts
      855
      Thanks
      13
      Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      I think that it's wrong. I also disagree with people who say Snowden is a traitor or a terrorist - he is a whistleblower, who leaked classified information to expose a far greater crime. What he did he did for the greater good, in the public interest.


      As for whether the NSA's activities in question actually help...


      The Federal judge that recently declared that the NSA's activities in question were likely to be unconstitutional also said the following:

      NSA collection of phone metadata likely in breach of fourth amendment

      The Government does not cite a single instance in which analysis of the NSA's bulk metadata collection actually stopped an imminent attack, or otherwise aided the Government in achieving any objective that was time-sensitive in nature.
      Given the limited record before me at this point in the notably, the utter lack of evidence that a terrorist attack has ever been prevented because searching the NSA database was faster than other investigative tactics--I have serious doubts about the efficacy of the metadata collection program as a means of conducting time-sensitive investigations in cases involving imminent threats of terrorism.
      The Government could have requested permission to present additional, potentially classified evidence in camera, but it chose not to do so. Although the Govemment has publicly asserted that the NSA's surveillance programs have prevented fifty-four terrorist attacks, no proof of that has been put before me.
      ["in-camera" = privately in the Judge's chambers]


      While Obama's own Review Group into the NSA's activities said the following (in addition to making various recommendations):

      NSA review panel findings: Liberty and Security in a Changing World

      Our review suggests that the information contributed to terrorist investigations by the use of section 215 telephony meta-data was not essential to preventing attacks and could readily have been obtained in a timely manner using conventional section 215 orders.

    4. #3
      dog-man's Avatar
      dog-man is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange: About 130 mtrs from the cabinet.
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro
      Router: Asus 3200
      Sky TV: Freesat
      Join Date
      Aug 2007
      Location
      Planet Earth
      Posts
      1,651
      Thanks
      88
      Thanked 20 Times in 20 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      No it is not right to spy willy nilly on every person in this country or any country.

      If there are reasonable evidence that suggests an individual is up to no good, then spying is fine, but definitely not otherwise.

      It is about time that the people stood up against their Governments and stopped this happening.

    5. #4
      Scubbie's Avatar
      Scubbie is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: 02392
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited
      Router: Sky Q Hub ER110
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Mar 2010
      Location
      Near Portsmouth
      Posts
      28,200
      Thanks
      842
      Thanked 2,223 Times in 2,092 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      What gets me is the shear volume of data being collected and remaining unprocessed.

      Personally I feel violated by the revelations of the level of data collection. Someone out there is watching my life in an uninvited capacity and monitoring every move I make, every private message I send and any calls I make.

      Since I do not have a criminal record, have not track record of causing violence towards masses of human beings (sorry but those flies really should have avoided the front of my car), and I am not involved in the transportation of weapons of any kind, I do not believe that I should be considered a viable threat to the freedom of the USA or any other country.

      Whether a judge considers the surveillance to be constitutional or not for the US government, I live in a different country. This country has different laws. This government should not be allowing the USA to spy on me and should also not be spying on me.

      Our weak and feeble politicians are only interested in getting big wads of money in their accounts. They are not interested in working for the people who elected them and this comment I make having met some of them.
      jrfer likes this.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

    6. #5
      Scubbie's Avatar
      Scubbie is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: 02392
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited
      Router: Sky Q Hub ER110
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Mar 2010
      Location
      Near Portsmouth
      Posts
      28,200
      Thanks
      842
      Thanked 2,223 Times in 2,092 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      You have to laugh:

      BBC News - ACLU sues US government over NSA spying
      The US government is being sued by civil liberties groups for details about the National Security Agency (NSA) overseas surveillance programme.

      The American Civil Liberties Union (ACLU) wants to find out what happens to data on Americans the NSA scoops up.

      The lawsuit comes three days after a US judge ruled that a separate NSA spying programme was lawful.

      More details of the NSA's access to phones and networking hardware have been released by privacy campaigners...

      ...In a speech given to the Chaos Communications Congress in Hamburg, Mr Applebaum said the NSA had managed to put back doors into products made by Cisco, Dell, Apple, HP, Huawei and Juniper Networks.

      "Basically their goal is to have total surveillance of everything that they are interested in," Mr Applebaum told the conference.
      I wonder what will happen next?

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

    7. #6
      Tezcatlipoca's Avatar
      Tezcatlipoca is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: Cambridge (EACAM)
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro
      Router: Sky Hub SR101
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Feb 2007
      Location
      Cambridge
      Posts
      855
      Thanks
      13
      Thanked 7 Times in 7 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      Our Government and our intelligence services don't care - they're in bed with the NSA themselves, as shown by the Snowden revelations regarding GCHQ's cooperation. Maybe the EU will push for something to be done, though.

      As for the latest law suit... I'm sure that this whole thing will end up at the US Supreme Court eventually. There's already been two wildly different verdicts in two different Federal courts this month, with one judge saying it's unconstitutional and another saying it's perfectly legal.

    8. #7
      jrfer's Avatar
      jrfer is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange: Rushden
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro
      Router: Sky Hub SR101
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Jul 2007
      Location
      Northants
      Posts
      250
      Thanks
      2
      Thanked 11 Times in 11 Posts

      Re: To spy or not to spy, that is the question

      Unfortunately the USA is the World's premier superpower and does what the hell it wants in order to feather it's own nest. Anyone disagreeing will have to withstand a huge trade embargo against them and/or the onslaught of the cruise missiles and squads of M1A1Abrams.

      The European Union is the only thing that has the muscle to stand firm against them. However I doubt there is enough collective will amongst the members to do so.

      In any case the EU are too busy arguing about the acceptable shape of Bananas to notice or care whats going on in the real world outside of Brussels.
      Scubbie likes this.

     

     

    Tags for this Thread

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •  
    SkyUser - Copyright © 2006-2020. SatDish and NewsreadeR | SkyUser is in no way affiliated with Sky Broadband / BSkyB
    RIPA NOTICE: NO CONSENT IS GIVEN FOR INTERCEPTION OF PAGE TRANSMISSION