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    Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

    This is a discussion on Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere? within the Sky & DLM forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; Originally Posted by IWasNotTheEnemy There won't be anything else they can do as they're not going to change the exchange ...

    1. #11
      BLaZeDRas's Avatar
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by IWasNotTheEnemy View Post
      There won't be anything else they can do as they're not going to change the exchange gear or noise margins for one customer. If you're that bothered then best thing would've been to stay with Be

      The only thing that could be wrong, as I've suggested, is a line fault due to the speed increasing when on the phone. All you can do is get onto Sky and let them see the sync speeds on and off the phone and get them onto BT
      I'm with sky for my line rental as well, I assume its sky's own telephone exchange equipment, or are they just reselling BT lines?

      Either way they should do something about it "for one customer" since its affecting my line/experience and thats wat customer service is supposed to be. The line isn't performing properly and sometimes cuts off mid-calls (not as often as the other problems but it happens). Anyhow changing pairs over at the exchange should not be something off-limits to an ISP especially with their own equipment, Be would do it without question (they did at my old address).

      Yes I should have stayed with Be, and was going to but hindsight is all I have now as I'm in a contract til October. The only reason I changed is because I have been with sky before many years ago and they were fine, no problems with getting poor syncs/pings like EVERY sky member seems to get now.


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    3. #12
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Every Sky member? My sync and pings are fine for my line.

      There's obviously some kind of issue if you re-sync at a higher speed when on the phone and also the phone dropping calls. If you can confirm that it still happens from the test socket, then as suggested, get onto Sky to log a fault to Openreach.

      And a tie pair shift is not 'off limits'. Sky do it, but there are set procedures that must be done before even thinking of a TPS.

    4. #13
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by User05 View Post
      Every Sky member? My sync and pings are fine for my line.

      There's obviously some kind of issue if you re-sync at a higher speed when on the phone and also the phone dropping calls. If you can confirm that it still happens from the test socket, then as suggested, get onto Sky to log a fault to Openreach.

      And a tie pair shift is not 'off limits'. Sky do it, but there are set procedures that must be done before even thinking of a TPS.
      everyone i've seen on this forum who is with sky on annex A receives 1mbit or less upload, why is that? It should be no problem to hit 1.3mbit upstream on the majority of 10+mbit downstream lines if not more than that.

      Pings are subjective I guess but I generally find better pings = better overall experience and skys pings are abysmal compared to Be's. I was receiving 13-17ms ping maximum to multiplay.co.uk, on sky I've never seen better than 32ms and the majority of the time its all over the place (jitter issues).

      As said previous it only happens sometimes and my router has never been out of the test socket (tried another sky router which sky replaced for no reason, tried dsl filters + cables, even tried different phones).

      I really wouldn't mind the proceedures that need to be undertaken before a switch of pairs IF the customer service of sky didnt treat u like an imbecile when they clearly have no knowledge of computers/networking themselves. It takes forever and a lot of convincing to get through to an "elevated support" technician who actually knows something about anything. I used to like sky, but that was a long time ago and they have changed completely since then, now they are just another ADSL2 provider who treat their customers like garbage. I do rate companies like this on their customer support and wish I could go back to Be... but I guess you don't miss something until you experience much worse (and I know sky are still better than a lot of the mainstream ISP's even today).

    5. #14
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Sky BB isn't an inferior product compared to Be. It is primarily aimed at at different market.

      You wrongly guessed that my speeds changed only because my wiring was moved at the exchange. The truth is that my speeds had been optimised as the result of a trial by my previous ISP.

      Sky's DLM optimises the connection, but not so much on speed, but for stability. You are looking for more speed.

      There is a profile that you may be able to obtain. It is known by those in Sky's customer services as the 'Gamer Profile'. It will reduce your pings to a small degree. Their number is 08442 414141.

      Give them a call and please stop saying that everyone's pings are rubbish when this clearly is not the case.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

    6. #15
      BLaZeDRas's Avatar
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by Scubbie View Post
      There is a profile that you may be able to obtain. It is known by those in Sky's customer services as the 'Gamer Profile'. It will reduce your pings to a small degree. Their number is 08442 414141.

      Give them a call and please stop saying that everyone's pings are rubbish when this clearly is not the case.
      I am on this "gamer profile" and the pings are still terrible.

      Sky's DLM is not needed nor does it do anything good for the line. I can see why they have used that though, no doubt it does prevent some people from ringing up customer support because they don't know how noise margins work and have lost connection.

      "optimised for stability" my ass, I never had a SINGLE disconnect from Be on my line that wasn't part of exchange maintenance or I hadn't caused myself.

    7. #16
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by BLaZeDRas View Post
      "optimised for stability" my ass, I never had a SINGLE disconnect from Be on my line that wasn't part of exchange maintenance or I hadn't caused myself.
      In that case, it is a free market.

      You are welcome to go somewhere else.

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

    8. #17
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by BLaZeDRas View Post
      Hi guys,

      back on BeThere I was receiving approximately 14-15mbit downstream 1.3mbit upstream on Annex A, and 12-13mbit downstream 1.8mbit upstream on Annex M+. Since moving to Sky my line has took a nose dive to 9-10mbit down, 800-900 kbit up. Sky use Annex A right? Why are the stats so different.

      Sometimes when using our phone (answering a call) it will disconnect me and resync at 13mbit / 1.1mbit and I will experience better ping times for the duration of the call; once the call ends the line will resync back to the lower figures and higher ping times. Another thing that happens every time a call is ended on the phone line (since the previous issue doesn't happen every time) is the broadband will get a "lag spike" of some sort for a couple of seconds.

      I have emailed Sky about it but having told them about this in the past I don't really expect much from them. I'm just curious as to why this happens and what Sky do to bugger up the line stats/line so much.

      thanks
      Hi,As a former Ukonline & now a Be* customer, with would you believe a very similar attenuation as yourself, there are a few reasons behind the dramatic drop in sync speeds,
      1, the level of interleave depth (as NO Fastpath)permitted(sky's policy)
      2, The higher than normal Default target SNRM again (sky's policy)
      3,Router chipset If ADSL how well it matches the connected exchange kit
      they are the physical factors,
      4, Sky's company policy of 1 size fit's all line profiles

      When i was with ukonline, my sync on on a attenuation of 32db down 15db up was 19,678kbps down & 1216kpbs (capped ) but throughput was higher,lol, with a target snrm of 4db and Fastpath enabled, (not sky's gaming mode answer) using a netgear dg83g v5 router,conexant chipset,
      now on be, even with a target snr of 3db and fastpath(no INP ) i sync at 18.200kbps down and 1416kbps up annex A on annex M similar to your stats, using Dg834 v4 broadcom chipped router, and ping times are slightly higher than Ukonline
      Last edited by tommy45; 20-02-11 at 09:17 PM.
      <a href=http://www.speedtest.net/result/754463629.png target=_blank>http://www.speedtest.net/result/754463629.png</a>

    9. #18
      BLaZeDRas's Avatar
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by Scubbie View Post
      In that case, it is a free market.

      You are welcome to go somewhere else.
      unfortunately its not since they tie you in to a long contract. I have to wait until October.

    10. #19
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      Quote Originally Posted by BLaZeDRas View Post
      I am on this "gamer profile" and the pings are still terrible.

      Sky's DLM is not needed nor does it do anything good for the line. I can see why they have used that though, no doubt it does prevent some people from ringing up customer support because they don't know how noise margins work and have lost connection.

      "optimised for stability" my ass, I never had a SINGLE disconnect from Be on my line that wasn't part of exchange maintenance or I hadn't caused myself.
      The above where partly the reason that i did not take sky's 6mths free offer for ukonline customers (DLM and NO fastpath) as i too am a gamer, but the server i regularly connect to is in Canada so every ms counts, as i would of
      lost several m-bits of sync speed due to interleave/DLM /7db default snr, all which effectively cap a connection,&even though the very same connection had worked without issue for the past 12mths + with no dlm or interleave or high snr they still would of done the above, all completely unnecessary and make it unfit for how i use the internet,
      <a href=http://www.speedtest.net/result/754463629.png target=_blank>http://www.speedtest.net/result/754463629.png</a>

    11. #20
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      Re: Does anyone know why Skys syncs are lower than BeThere?

      I fully appreciate the issues that you guys have.

      Personally I had a great package with another ISP. Unfortunately BT messed me around beyond a reasonable level.

      Previously I had no issues with my line. I believe the Noise Margin was around 5dB. I had 15.4Mb d/l & 2.3Mb u/l on Annex M. Prior to that i had 17.1Mb d/l & 1.3Mb u/l.

      With Sky I get 16.6Mb d/l & .9Mb u/l, with a noise margin of 7dB.

      What I don't get is the nasty attitude at the end of the telephone when I call customer services. I did have a small disagreement just after I signed up, but this was rectified the same day. I also had a few problems with a dodgy connection initially on the BB. Again this was resolved promptly.

      The problems with BT went on for 6 months and got really nasty. There is no way I will every be tempted to go back there.

      Now I am not saying that BSkyB will get it right every time. That would be impossible for any large firm. I am not saying the BeThere might not have a good customer services. I don't know what they are like.

      What I am saying is, for a non-gamer, that for a small decrease in speed & a miner difference in ping rates, I am very happy with what I have.

      I suspect that many other Sky users are also very happy too. With 1.2 million subscribers (Jan 2011) on the LLU service alone, I guess that they are doing well.

      Just my 2p (ex. vat)

      Sky Fibre Unlimited Pro: Connected at 80,000 kbps / 20,000 kbps
      Previous ADSL2+ Speed 19999 kbps 1153 kbps, Line Attenuation 17.5 db 6.9 db, Noise Margin 7.5 dB 8.7 dB
      Speedtest: 17.15MB/s 0.97Mb/s Ping 31 ms

     

     
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