Your forum username:
Do you already have an account?
Forgot your password?
  • Log in or Sign up


    Welcome to Sky User - The Unofficial Support Forum for everything Sky! - Proudly helping over 65k members.


    Advertisement

    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
    Results 1 to 10 of 12

    Third party router just stopped working

    This is a discussion on Third party router just stopped working within the Sky Broadband help forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; I'm on Sky broadband ADSL2+ unlimited. After extracting my user ID and password from my official Sky Netgear router I've ...

    1. #1
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Third party router just stopped working

      I'm on Sky broadband ADSL2+ unlimited. After extracting my user ID and password from my official Sky Netgear router I've been successfully connecting with my Fritz!Box 7390 router since June last year (i.e. about 11 months). My settings are Annex A, VPI 0, VCI 38, Encapsulation PPPoA/VC-MUX.

      Yesterday morning my internet was down. For the last 24 hours, after trying lots of reboots of my Fritz!Box, I do occasionally manage to get a connection, often after a very lengthy 15 minutes or so of the Fritz!Box saying that it's training, but the connection only lasts for a minute or two before it disconnects. I've gone back to the official Sky router and that seems to be connecting just fine.

      I'm trying to work out whether Sky might have changed something on my line on Saturday night that is stopping my Fritz!box from connecting and, if so, can I get round it?

      Given that my old router (and I mean old, it's the original router I was sent in 2008 when I signed up) still connects, and the fact that I can still get at least a transient connection from my Fritz!box, presumably Sky hasn't changed the password and/or userID on me. Is there anything else that they could have changed that would trip up my third-party router but still leave my 6.5 year old Netgear router connecting OK?

      One possibility that occurs to me is MAC address verification but if that is the case then surely I would be getting a total lockout when using my Fritz!box and not having these occasional connections for a couple of minutes.

      If it's not a Sky issue then it looks as if the modem in my Fritz!box might be failing which for once is happening a few weeks inside the warranty rather than outside so I suppose that's something to be thankful for although it is a total pain to send back since I also run my DECT phones through it.

      Any ideas of things to try regarding changes at the Sky end before I contact Fritz!Box for a warranty repair?

      - Julian


    2. Advertisement
    3. #2
      moleman's Avatar
      moleman is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange: Hadleigh EAHAE
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: DG834GT + TL-WR702N
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      825
      Thanks
      10
      Thanked 31 Times in 29 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Julian, are you in S.E. England by any chance? If so your original problem may have been the total line/broadband blackout that Sky had yesterday. I'm guessing that during troubleshooting you powered your Fritz!Box off for the first time for awhile. If so, and also from your description of the problem it sounds like the Fritz!Box may have failing capacitors.

    4. #3
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Quote Originally Posted by moleman View Post
      Julian, are you in S.E. England by any chance? If so your original problem may have been the total line/broadband blackout that Sky had yesterday. I'm guessing that during troubleshooting you powered your Fritz!Box off for the first time for awhile. If so, and also from your description of the problem it sounds like the Fritz!Box may have failing capacitors.
      Thanks Moleman. I am in the Southeast and I did power-cycle my router quite a few times so your suggestion sounds entirely plausible. I'm 3 weeks away from my warranty expiring and if it wasn't for Sky's big outage then maybe I wouldn't have seen the fault until it was too late. I never thought that I'd be grateful for a major network failure.

      Are failing capacitors a known issue with the Fritz!Box routers or is it a common failure mode for ADSL modems in general? Also, are you talking about capacitors specifically in the modem circuitry? Presumably so since all other functions of my Fritz!Box still seem to be fully functional.

      - Julian

    5. #4
      moleman's Avatar
      moleman is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange: Hadleigh EAHAE
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: DG834GT + TL-WR702N
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      825
      Thanks
      10
      Thanked 31 Times in 29 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      I have no personal knowledge of the Fritz!Box, but I've experienced the problem on other routers. The problem of the faulty capacitors is supposed to be largely over now but your description seemed to fit the bill!

      Capacitor plague - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    6. #5
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Quote Originally Posted by moleman View Post
      I have no personal knowledge of the Fritz!Box, but I've experienced the problem on other routers. The problem of the faulty capacitors is supposed to be largely over now but your description seemed to fit the bill!
      Thanks for the reply. It might well be a router failure but from the Wikipedia link I'd be a bit surprised if it was the "capacitor plague" since my unit was probably manufactured in late 2012 or early 2013 which seems well after that was all going on.

      My invoice for the Fritz!box is dated 3rd June 2013 so I have three and a bit weeks until the warranty expires. At the moment I'm staying connected but getting quite a few 1 minute or so dropouts even with the official Sky router so I'm working with Sky for the next week or so to see if there might be a line issue. The basic line checks are coming back OK and they're seeing me connecting at a very respectable speed given my distance from the exchange but they are seeing a lot of errors on the line. They are currently running a long term line test and will review the results by next Tuesday and get back to me.

      There is a possibility that there is a fault on the copper somewhere that is causing a high error rate. Is it possible that my Fritz!box is working OK but has a different approach to high error rates, maybe putting itself back into a training mode if it thinks the rates are too high and then staying in training for a very long time whereas the official Sky router does a bit more of a quick and dirty disconnect and reconnect and sees how it goes?

      Given that I have a few weeks I think it's sensible to let Sky have a good look at the line before I ask AVM (the Fritz!box manufacturers) for a warranty repair or replacement. If nothing else I might get a new router from Sky which I assume would be the one with gigabit LAN ports. Lack of gigabit ports for my PC and NAS is one of the big issues that's had me using third party routers so if I can get that for free rather than having to pay 59 + P&P for it (which is Sky's standard price at the moment I think) then that would be something.

      - Julian

    7. #6
      Isitme's Avatar
      Isitme is offline Sky User Moderator
      Exchange: Bannockburn
      Broadband ISP: Sky Fibre Unlimited
      Router: Sky Hub SR102
      Sky TV: Sky+ HD
      Join Date
      Dec 2006
      Location
      Central Scotland
      Posts
      34,131
      Thanks
      64
      Thanked 1,641 Times in 1,602 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      I might get a new router from Sky which I assume would be the one with gigabit LAN ports.
      You assume wrong I'm afraid, Sky's newest routers still have 100mbps LAN ports.

      TomD


      Please note the views and recommendations in my posts are my own and in no way reflect the views of SkyUser.


      Useful Utilites

      http://www.nirsoft.net/utils/wifi_information_view.html/ TCPOptimiser /Test Socket

      Note - When downloading always select the Custom install or you will end up with stuff you don't want.





    8. #7
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Quote Originally Posted by Isitme View Post
      You assume wrong I'm afraid, Sky's newest routers still have 100mbps LAN ports.
      Yes. I discovered my mistake a few hours after posting but thanks for the confirmation of this sad fact. After my problems and irritation at Sky's unwillingness to support third part routers I started looking at options. I think I was confusing the new Sky Hub with one ISP that I discovered that had Gb ports but I can't remember who that was. I thought it might be BT Home hub but that only has a single gigabit port and that doesn't help in getting a decent wired PC <-> NAS connection. Still, Sky is far from alone in not offering Gb LAN but when will these ISPs enter the previous decade as far as LAN ports on their routers is concerned?

      The good news however is that I discovered my Fritz!box has a 5 year warranty so plenty of time to investigate. I'm now thinking that the Fritz!box being far less tolerant of high error rates on the line (taking longer to train and dropping the connection to retrain more readily when it sees high error rates) might be the issue. I'll see what Sky tech support have to say about my line test results early next week.

      - Julian

    9. #8
      Saturday's Avatar
      Saturday is offline Sky User Super Mod
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited Pro
      Router: Sky Hub SR102
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      6,086
      Thanks
      20
      Thanked 52 Times in 47 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Quote Originally Posted by Julian View Post
      that doesn't help in getting a decent wired PC <-> NAS connection.
      You don't need a Gigabit router for a Gigabit LAN. Buy a Gigabit switch, (they're really inexpensive) and connect everything to that i.e. router => switch =>devices. Your NAS and PC then have a Gigabit connection to each other and don't need to go through the router.

    10. #9
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      Quote Originally Posted by Saturday View Post
      You don't need a Gigabit router for a Gigabit LAN. Buy a Gigabit switch, (they're really inexpensive) and connect everything to that i.e. router => switch =>devices.
      I know but I'm on a mission to reduce my number of boxes and associated power-bricks/wall-warts, a separate switch takes me in exactly the wrong direction. That's why I loved the Fritz!box when it was all working OK. Router, DECT base station, answering machine and call blocker all in one unit. I'm hoping that I'll get back to that setup. My ideal scenario would be for Sky to find something wrong with the copper, the error rates to reduce drastically after it's fixed, and for my Fritz!box to simply plug back in and things start working again but faster and more responsive than before. I'll see how it goes.

      - Julian

    11. #10
      Julian's Avatar
      Julian is offline Sky User Member
      Exchange:
      Broadband ISP: Sky Broadband Unlimited
      Router: Netgear V2 DG934G
      Sky TV: Sky+HD box
      Join Date
      Sep 2006
      Posts
      50
      Thanks
      0
      Thanked 0 Times in 0 Posts

      Re: Third party router just stopped working

      A BT Openreach engineer just visited and, even though his very first test showed a rectified loop error on the line, subsequent tests all showed it OK. He changed the master socket anyway because mine was over a decade old. After he'd left I plugged back in the official Sky router and the performance was as horrible as ever. A speed test showed me getting 0.992Mbs download speed. I forget what the upload speed was but it was equally pitiful, about 0.1Mbs I think. Unfortunately the Sky router I have doesn't have any status information at all that I can find so I can't see the actual sync speed and am forced to use online speed checkers to test.

      Out of desperation I plugged my Fritz!box back in but it still wouldn't really connect. After 5 to 15 minutes of training it would connect for maybe 15 seconds or so before the event log showed "Internet connection cleared". Getting even more desperate I tried changing the encapsulation from PPPoA/VC-MUX to PPPoA/LLC and my Fritz!box connected pretty much instantly, the internet went back to being acceptable (synced at 8.6Mbs down but that's with me telling the Fritz!box to assume an unstable line so it's not trying to connect at the maximum possible speed). So far the connection has been up for about 20 minutes so it seems stable as well.

      I'd been using PPPoA/VC-MUX for almost a year now, I think based on very old posts on this forum about using third party routers that I would have found when I was setting it up in mid 2013, but it really does look as if Sky switched to PPPoA/LLC on my line. Is that possible and/or likely? If that's not the case then I find it hard to explain why about a week ago I suddenly stopped being able to get any sort of stable connection on PPPoA/VC-MUX which until then had worked perfectly.

      - Julian

     

     
    Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

    Tags for this Thread

    Posting Permissions

    • You may not post new threads
    • You may not post replies
    • You may not post attachments
    • You may not edit your posts
    •  
    SkyUser - Copyright © 2006-2017. SatDish and NewsreadeR | SkyUser is in no way affiliated with Sky Broadband / BSkyB
    RIPA NOTICE: NO CONSENT IS GIVEN FOR INTERCEPTION OF PAGE TRANSMISSION