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    Upstream attenuation halved?

    This is a discussion on Upstream attenuation halved? within the Sky Broadband help forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; @ Snadge Billion at the mo have tried out the sky router supplied, the same. There was capacity issue back ...

    1. #31
      NilSatisOptimum's Avatar
      NilSatisOptimum is offline Sky User Member
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      @ Snadge Billion at the mo have tried out the sky router supplied, the same. There was capacity issue back in the spring however this was resolved, nowt else changes 28ms, down 46db 7002 - up 800kbps 18db-33db, 26db this week.
      Last edited by NilSatisOptimum; 30-08-12 at 08:31 PM. Reason: direction


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    3. #32
      gymno's Avatar
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Just phoned sky with my pings going from 24ms to 70ms & as i suspected there's nothing they can do.
      They were prepared to pass it on to the network team, but will need some traceroute data for that to be worthwhile.
      No errors on my line though apparently.

      I was wondering if this reverse trace revealed anything in relation to the one i did here while my pings were normal: Upstream attenuation halved?

      traceroute to 176.xxx.xxx.xx (176.xxx.xxx.xx), 25 hops max, 40 byte packets
      1 static-ip-188-138-112-3.inaddr.ip-pool.com (188.138.112.3) 2.307 ms
      2 *
      3 te2-7.ccr01.sxb03.atlas.cogentco.com (149.11.26.13) 0.449 ms
      4 *
      5 te0-2-0-6.mpd21.fra03.atlas.cogentco.com (154.54.62.217) 3.741 ms
      6 tiscali.fra03.atlas.cogentco.com (130.117.14.86) 3.583 ms
      7 xe-2-0-1.lon10.ip4.tinet.net (89.149.185.234) 21.602 ms
      8 easynet-gw.ip4.tinet.net (77.67.74.94) 19.304 ms
      9 ip-89-200-134-43.ov.easynet.net (89.200.134.43) 19.630 ms
      10 10.245.133.12 (10.245.133.12) 21.479 ms
      11 b0f8ba3a.bb.sky.com (176.xxx.xxx.xx) 61.276 ms
      12 b0f8ba3a.bb.sky.com (176.xxx.xxx.xx) 62.119 ms

      Sky have started dlm for me, just to see if it helps but with this issue only occurring at peak times, i guess i'm just going to have to try & borrow a laptop before i can get anywhere near a solution.

      *Edit- Forgot to mention. That trace was done before dlm was started.
      Last edited by gymno; 31-08-12 at 07:17 PM.

    4. #33
      gymno's Avatar
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Based on the advice that i read somewhere on this forum the other day, when the cst lady said that she'd start dlm, i asked if it could be done starting off using default values.
      She was happy to do this & so my stats, as of 10pm last night are:
      (Note i'm still getting a random upstream attenuation).

      ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
      Connection Speed 4095*kbps 606*kbps
      Line Attenuation 22.5*dB 10.9*dB
      Noise Margin 16.3*dB 18.9*dB

      With (off-peak) pings of:

      PING 212.58.241.131 (212.58.241.131): 56 data bytes
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=0 ttl=247 time=40.5 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=1 ttl=247 time=40.7 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=2 ttl=247 time=40.3 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=3 ttl=247 time=40.3 ms

      According to cst, this default profile uses 16ms delays, so 40ms seems a good benchmark.
      Incidentally, she also said that before, i was on something called "the 20meg service profile".
      Never heard of the 'service' profile...

      Anyway, dlm hasn't actually started yet, but it'll be interesting to see what happens with my pings between 8 & 11pm after it has.

    5. #34
      User05's Avatar
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Quote Originally Posted by gymno View Post
      According to cst, this default profile uses 16ms delays, so 40ms seems a good benchmark.
      That's correct.

      Quote Originally Posted by gymno View Post
      Incidentally, she also said that before, i was on something called "the 20meg service profile".
      Never heard of the 'service' profile...
      SVBN has two 'main profiles' - service and gamer profile.

      Service profile just means they first select from a drop down menu on the target SNRs (range from lowest being 7dB and highest 15dB) e.g. 7dB ds /7dB us, 9dB ds /7dB us etc. and then from a literal graph which has the different profiles available. They're very limited on SVBN, hence why you see people calling up asking for their downstream to be uncapped and then ending up with 768kbps upstream - the profiles are just way too limited. I don't know the technical side behind it, but the ISAMs seem more friendly with applying any profile and if the line is fine, it'll stay stable. Back in the day, uncapping a line rate on a Stinger way past what the line could handle just seemed to cause issues. However, on the ISAMs, you can seemingly uncap a long line to 20 down / 1.2 up and it'll stay solid just fine.

      Gamer profile just means they select a pre set 'gamer' profile from a drop down. There are only around 3-4 of them if I remember right and, again, very limited - 2048/416, 10240/800, 20000/1216. It's just a way of dumbing it down because presumably a lot don't realise 'gamer' profiles are just 8ms delays, which are available on the service profile list any way.
      gymno likes this.

    6. #35
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Thanks for the info user05.
      I was never really sure whether the actual gamer profiles had something a little extra going on or not.

      DLM kicked in last night & started me off with this:

      ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
      Connection Speed 6142*kbps 797*kbps
      Line Attenuation 22.5*dB 8.9*dB
      Noise Margin 15.3*dB 17.3*dB

      More importantly for me, pings have been a solid 36ms all day...
      Until i just checked:

      PING 212.58.241.131 (212.58.241.131): 56 data bytes
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=0 ttl=247 time=63.1 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=1 ttl=247 time=78.4 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=2 ttl=247 time=72.3 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=3 ttl=247 time=72.6 ms

      Just gotta borrow that laptop & get some traceroutes done for the network team to investigate.

    7. #36
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Todays DLM: (still getting random upstream attenuation)

      ADSL Link Downstream Upstream
      Connection Speed 9215*kbps 1112*kbps
      Line Attenuation 23.0*dB 13.1*dB
      Noise Margin 16.1*dB 8.8*dB < This also jumps from 8.6 to 9.6 with each refresh/poll interval

      Todays ping:

      PING 212.58.241.131 (212.58.241.131): 56 data bytes
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=0 ttl=247 time=33.7 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=1 ttl=247 time=33.1 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=2 ttl=247 time=33.8 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=3 ttl=247 time=33.5 ms

      7:45pm:

      PING 212.58.241.131 (212.58.241.131): 56 data bytes
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=0 ttl=247 time=75.3 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=1 ttl=247 time=65.7 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=2 ttl=247 time=74.3 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=3 ttl=247 time=59.6 ms

      It'll probably get worse up until about 10:45pm.

      Due to personal reasons, it's proven to be almost impossible to borrow a laptop.
      I'm actually considering buying a 2nd hand one, just to sort this problem out, thus enabling me to give sky the traceroute data.

      *Edit- That is unless anyone has any other suggestions
      Last edited by gymno; 02-09-12 at 09:58 PM.

    8. #37
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      double post
      Last edited by gymno; 02-09-12 at 09:34 PM. Reason: ps3 browser + skyuser forum bug

    9. #38
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      9:45pm

      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=0 ttl=247 time=95.7 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=1 ttl=247 time=101.6 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=2 ttl=247 time=94.5 ms
      56 bytes from 212.58.241.131: icmp_seq=3 ttl=247 time=85.6 ms

    10. #39
      snadge's Avatar
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      hi again,

      the unfortunate thing is; this is 'acute' congestion/overloaded ISAM and unless it gets worse sky wont recognize it as being problematic (as technically it isnt, just for gamers it is), most your pings are what they would consider to be 'reasonable' - if you can get them to query your local network team then great, hopefully they will try something for you.

      hope it works out for you bud
      - Hardware - Netgear DG834Nv1
      - Line Attenuation - 27.5db
      - Sync Rate - 17,600k
      - Noise Margin - 7db
      - Latency - 28ms

    11. #40
      gymno's Avatar
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      Re: Upstream attenuation halved?

      Cheers snadge.

      So is it just coincidence that all this started immediately after the lift & shift was (needlessly) done?
      Is it technically possible that the slot i'm currently in is overloaded, but the previous one wasn't?
      If so, it'll be something i'll mention when i call sky again after dlm has finished.

      This may seem like a non-issue to most people, but gaming is the only reason i got broadband in the first place.
      Having just got my line back to a usable state after more than 2 months of hassle, it's depressing.
      Not being able to game satisfactorily would be the end of sky bb & talk for me.

     

     
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