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    How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

    This is a discussion on How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package? within the Sky Broadband help forums, part of the Sky Broadband help and support category; We currently have UKO's LLU package at our office, which we run our Voice over IP phones off (we have ...

    1. #1
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      How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      We currently have UKO's LLU package at our office, which we run our Voice over IP phones off (we have EXCELLENT latency on the circuit, it's usually about 10ms to our SIP gateway which dramatically improves RTT) and the quality of the broadband is generally excellent. Never slows down, can always max it out on demand etc.

      What's worried me is that UKO is shutting up shop, and the simplest way for us to move ISPs is to migrate to Sky. However, UKO say that Sky is clearly not a Business service but we couldn't justify the cost of a 100 per month circuit with Easynet! So we're in somewhat of a quandary.


      What are pings and overall latency like on the Sky broadband package? We're not so much concerned about headline speed, we need accurate and reliable latency on the connection because any fluctuation becomes immediately obviously in VoIP telephone calls (the sound stutters, breaks up and generally sounds 'robotic' is the best way to describe it). We can't get much else in the way of LLU that's half good, so if Sky isn't up to snuff we're going to have to go to a more expensive WBC-based provider which I don't really want to do

      Can anybody with experience of both UKO and Sky's LLU packages proffer some advice before we have to pick an option later this month?

      Many thanks
      Chris


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    3. #2
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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      tbh you're better off going with BE or someone a bit more open to line configurations than Sky. whereas users on Sky LLU have good pings chances are you're on fastpath which Sky don't offer so you may want to look at someone else
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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      I'm a BE Pro customer myself at home on Annex M and Fastpath so I'm aware of its existence

      Unfortunately the best LLU service we can get is the UKOnline LLU, hence why we went with it! BE were due to activate our exchange but then called it off, SamKnows hasn't shown an update in status since then (2009).


      I think what we'll probably have to end up doing is going to someone like Zen for their Pro package (which I recommended to my Dad and who has it at home) - it's dearer but I know from experience it's good quality. It just seems such a retrograde step moving back onto the BT WBC network...


      If anybody views this thread and uses Sky LLU with VoIP equipment, could you post any feedback on call quality, latency etc? I'm concerned about pings and continuous latency / jitter, if the VoIP don't work properly after our (forced!) migration it'll be me who gets it in the neck

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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      I think you should consider that Sky are a domestic service and specifically ban its use for business purposes.

      It just seems such a retrograde step moving back onto the BT WBC network..
      It is hardly retrograde, 21CN WBC means the exchange has been upgraded to ADSL2+, which should give an equal if not superior performance compared to Easynet. You might want to have a look at Plusnet's offerings. They will be able to offer ADSL2+. I don't know if they offer Fastpath, but it may be worth enquiring.

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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      Quote Originally Posted by Isitme View Post
      I think you should consider that Sky are a domestic service and specifically ban its use for business purposes.

      It is hardly retrograde, 21CN WBC means the exchange has been upgraded to ADSL2+, which should give an equal if not superior performance compared to Easynet. You might want to have a look at Plusnet's offerings. They will be able to offer ADSL2+. I don't know if they offer Fastpath, but it may be worth enquiring.
      What I meant by retrograde is that the WBC platform is intrinsically more expensive given the wholesale bandwidth costs. IMO you get less value for money on a WBC-based IPStream package unless you're paying through the nose (which we can't afford to do). On our regular 'bulk traffic' DSL connection we have BT Business BB Option 2, it really is shockingly poor, Ellacoya shaping is clearly evident when downloading patches from HP.com etc etc.

      We would've gone with Telewest Business cable a couple of years ago but they implemented STM on it! (we're a media-centric business and we do a LOT of uploading to our digital partners - we would probably trip STM twice a day, if not more), and again from personal experience a couple of years ago (just around when 20Mb was introduced) latency and jitter were somewhat unpredictable, even on a good connection with no peak time congestion.


      Plusnet also only seem able to offer 8138/832 for 28(12mo) or 25(24mo), if they can't offer ADSL2+ on business packages I don't have much hope for Fastpath


      I've been considering Zen & Xilo in that order, can't really think of any truly good SMB-oriented DSL packages that cost less than 50pcm.

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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      You can get Fastpath on BT Wholesale connections, we used to turn it on for customer on Sky Connect (when I worked at CST) so I'd imagine other business connections with other ISPs can do the same
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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      Quote Originally Posted by IWasNotTheEnemy View Post
      You can get Fastpath on BT Wholesale connections, we used to turn it on for customer on Sky Connect (when I worked at CST) so I'd imagine other business connections with other ISPs can do the same

      Unfortunately I think it's probably policy to not enable Fastpath for customers requesting it at most ISPs (I doubt the option's even made available to the first line CSRs!)

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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      Last job I had, after leaving Sky, also allowed Fastpath on business connections. Worked at Chess Telecom but provided through Eclipse for BTW and Opal for LLU

      Might be worth calling about and see what's available...
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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      Quote Originally Posted by IWasNotTheEnemy View Post
      Last job I had, after leaving Sky, also allowed Fastpath on business connections. Worked at Chess Telecom but provided through Eclipse for BTW and Opal for LLU

      Might be worth calling about and see what's available...
      Ah, of course yes, forgot about TalkTalk's B2B service. Completely forgot about them for no reason! (our VoIP number ranges are through Opal and I've spoken to them in the past about possible SIP trunking). Already put in an enquiry, hopefully get an email back with answers later / tomorrow.

      Likewise I'd considered Eclipse in the past but discounted them for some reason; I'll check them out again now...

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      Re: How does Sky LLU compare to UKO's LLU package?

      So (as I expected) ten minutes after I did a line check on Opal's site, I had a callback. Turns out they can do fastpath, and if we go broadband only it's 15pcm. If we go with them for WLR service (bb+phone) it's a shade under 24.

      Apparently they don't traffic shape or limit download speeds at all, I'd be interested to hear from any current Opal customers as to how they're finding their connection (in particular latency) but I don't expect that to happen soon! Fortunately Opal have LLU gear in our local exchange now, a development since we first signed up with UKOnline, so we wouldn't be going over BT's centrals.

      I emailed Eclipse yesterday, no response yet.

     

     
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